Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Scarab on Tue Oct 16, 2012 6:13 am

Inukai44 wrote:
Scarab wrote:
Inukai44 wrote:If that happens she will be grave danger and we can't let that happen since her "patient" is a serial killer.


Oh lord, I never even thought of that. :shock: Why is there no facepalm emoticon on this site?

Well I guess this way at least she'll KNOW there's a threat, I mean, he's dangerous either way, and knowing is better than not knowing, right? And given what she's put up with so far... I don't know. She seems a tough cookie, I hope she can handle herself well enough but we should do our best to protect her, either way.

At the risk of sounding HORRIFICALLY cliche, she could honestly be his last chance for redemption. Let's try not to make that at the expense of her safety.

Ok... I guess we should tell her about the other fictional characters expect Sweeny until she asks and give her Mr.A's contact info and also the annocement video


Well let's wait and see what she thinks after checking out something of Sweeny Todd first, don't want to rush her into something she isn't ready for...
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Dryunya on Tue Oct 16, 2012 7:57 am

My thought on that:
  1. We wait until she realizes his delusion are clearly modelled after Sweeney and posts about it.
  2. Then someone of us tells her that there are more cases like that.
  3. And then we link her to Joe's channel - not the WTF site or Mr. A, because she'd dismiss it as nonsense. Joe's videos are from an Average Guy's POV, so she may have some thoughts on that.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Scarab on Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:09 am

Dryunya wrote:My thought on that:
  1. We wait until she realizes his delusion are clearly modelled after Sweeney and posts about it.
  2. Then someone of us tells her that there are more cases like that.
  3. And then we link her to Joe's channel - not the WTF site or Mr. A, because she'd dismiss it as nonsense. Joe's videos are from an Average Guy's POV, so she may have some thoughts on that.


Sounds like a plan :)
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Wysp on Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:43 pm

I've been cheating a little bit by using information gleaned from her messages to talk to her, but basically I said that he might have based his delusions on the movie, but she knows (and we know, but she doesn't know we know) that he's been calling himself BB since prior to the time he claimed he'd seen the movie, which means that something else is up.

Also, interestingly (and I didn't notice this before)--he knows that there's a movie. Which means that he knows he's fictional, unlike Holmes and Poirot's original beliefs (those two would indicate that not all fictionals are aware of their status and that crossing the Wall isn't an event they're consciously aware of).
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Scarab on Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:50 pm

Wysp wrote:I've been cheating a little bit by using information gleaned from her messages to talk to her, but basically I said that he might have based his delusions on the movie, but she knows (and we know, but she doesn't know we know) that he's been calling himself BB since prior to the time he claimed he'd seen the movie, which means that something else is up.

Also, interestingly (and I didn't notice this before)--he knows that there's a movie. Which means that he knows he's fictional, unlike Holmes and Poirot's original beliefs (those two would indicate that not all fictionals are aware of their status and that crossing the Wall isn't an event they're consciously aware of).


This may be true but just because he knows the movie exists and may be about him, doesn't mean he's seen it or accepts that he is fictional. If anybody's good at denial then it's Sweeney Todd.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Zup on Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:57 pm

Didn't Sherlock go on about how he only rarely wears a Deerstalker, never says "Elementary, my dear Watson," etc.? And he still has troubles accepting that he's fictional. So I don't think it's impossible for Ben Barker to see the film and write it off somehow.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Sicon112 on Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:29 pm

It is also possible that he DOESN'T know that there is a movie. He perhaps just figured that his life was weird enough to be one.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby agoraoptera on Wed Oct 17, 2012 3:52 am

Hi, I may have missed something, being new, but what about that protest group BB belongs to? What are the odds that BB's not hung up with any ol' protest group, but something secretly organised by, I don't know, the Cabal? Pardon me if I'm just wasting bits. :)

"He said that his friends told him to come, that it might help him “adjust.” His friends appear to be protesters he met while living on the streets of Boston’s North End"
The word 'adjust' being so suspicious right there. Also, usually psychiatrists cost a bit, don't they? Its possible that the co-op may be paying the Therapist for BB, but it strikes me as odd somehow.

On a side note, I'd like to point out that to the best of my knowledge, every portrayal of Sweeney Todd ends in his death (whether hanging or stabbing), except one where he's committed to an asylum. If we send him back, does that mean he's gonna die? Not that I'm particularly concerned about the physical well-being of a metaphysical character, but hey, meta-morality. :P

EDIT: I just saw the 'sending them back dilemma' thread so neeever mind about that last paragraph~
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby narrativedilettante on Wed Oct 17, 2012 8:56 am

We don't have a lot of information about the protest group. I suspect it was just there to provide background color, however I'm willing to keep an open mind as to the Cabal being involved.

Regarding the expense of psychiatrists, there are some programs that allow at-risk people to receive free therapy; for instance, someone who's just been released from prison might be required to attend therapy sessions that are paid for by the state because it's considered the best way to keep him/her from sliding back into a previous, harmful lifestyle. I'm under the impression this is one of those situations. Sweeney might be staying at a place specializing in at-risk people. If that's the case, they might have a fund dedicated to getting psychiatric help for their residents. It's also conceivable that, in addition to paying clients, the therapist takes on some cases for free as a form of community service. (Meta: the matter of payment is probably glossed over for the sake of simplicity.) But, again, it's entirely possible there's something else here. If there is, though, I don't think we have enough information to figure it out yet.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Dryunya on Wed Oct 17, 2012 2:54 pm

agoraoptera wrote:Also, usually psychiatrists cost a bit, don't they? Its possible that the co-op may be paying the Therapist for BB, but it strikes me as odd somehow.

She picked him as a test subject for her paper. It may be free in that case... I dunno. :?
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Inukai44 on Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:10 pm

Since Hercule is heading there I think it is almost time to tell her. What is your thoughts guys :?:
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby WackyMeetsPractical on Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:22 pm

Inukai44 wrote:Since Hercule is heading there I think it is almost time to tell her. What is your thoughts guys :?:


I think she's the one that contacted him in the first place. She mentioned consulting a detective online in a previous post, I believe.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Inukai44 on Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:23 pm

Okay!
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Sicon112 on Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:30 pm

I would leave Poirot to do his thing and not interfere. Yet. Let's wait till they post the first update.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Zup on Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:41 pm

Joan updated her blog. The date threw me for a second since its the 18th here. It seems our intrepid Belgian detective is already on the case.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Sicon112 on Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:44 pm

Zup wrote:Joan updated her blog. The date threw me for a second since its the 18th here. It seems our intrepid Belgian detective is already on the case.


Yea, but not enough info to act on it yet. Wait to tell her for the moment, since she is figuring things out. Someone should bring up the point that if his delusions DO get worse, he could be capable of some pretty horrendous things, so she should be cautious. Also, say something like "Hey, you said you were getting strange calls a while ago, so what if the same people are stalking your patients now too?"
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby narrativedilettante on Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:46 pm

It looks like Sweeney is well on the path to becoming an ally against the Cabal. Of course, I doubt he'll ever be stable and predictable. If he's backed into a corner I won't assume he'll do the right thing.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Zup on Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:49 pm

narrativedilettante wrote:It looks like Sweeney is well on the path to becoming an ally against the Cabal. Of course, I doubt he'll ever be stable and predictable. If he's backed into a corner I won't assume he'll do the right thing.


Against the cabal? The prevailing theory is that the "protesters" are really the Cabal in disguise. But who knows.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Sicon112 on Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:53 pm

Zup wrote:
narrativedilettante wrote:It looks like Sweeney is well on the path to becoming an ally against the Cabal. Of course, I doubt he'll ever be stable and predictable. If he's backed into a corner I won't assume he'll do the right thing.


Against the cabal? The prevailing theory is that the "protesters" are really the Cabal in disguise. But who knows.


No, it seems as though the Cabal is following him for now. They will try to turn him, I suspect, but it remains to be seen how he will take that. Most likely he will either snap totally and go after them if they say the wrong thing, or worse, join them and get progressively more psycho until we either get rid of him or redeem him, depending on how straight evil he is supposed to be portrayed in this ARG.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby narrativedilettante on Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:55 pm

What Sicon said.

I never bought the idea that the protesters were part of the Cabal, though I'm open to the idea. I think it's more likely they are the ones following him.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby Guyshane on Thu Oct 18, 2012 12:11 am

Personally I think that Sweeny will most likely be a neutral party in this whole affair
I say we nuke it from orbit...its the only way to be sure.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby HarDHarKoopa on Thu Oct 18, 2012 1:03 am

As I posted there, I am glad he's doing better. Honestly, he's one of the characters I'm not sure I want sent back. He could live a good, long, healthy life here, maybe even make a difference in the causes he wants to help. If we send him back, he'll just be a murderer who dies again. We need to protect him and his therapist.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby NeverSlender on Thu Oct 18, 2012 6:46 am

HarDHarKoopa wrote:As I posted there, I am glad he's doing better. Honestly, he's one of the characters I'm not sure I want sent back. He could live a good, long, healthy life here, maybe even make a difference in the causes he wants to help. If we send him back, he'll just be a murderer who dies again. We need to protect him and his therapist.


He already confessed to a murder in the voicemail he left.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby HarDHarKoopa on Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:09 am

I can't quite remember the specifics, do we know if that murder was here or in his story? If the latter, I think him getting mental help, and a chance to live a new life isn't that bad. In a weird way, didn't he not have a choice for his previous murder(s)? He was written to do so by an author. If he uses his new free will, unbound by the scribes quill, to be a new man, I say let him.
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Re: Protecting "Sweeney Todd" and the notebook

Postby narrativedilettante on Thu Oct 18, 2012 8:50 am

HarDHarKoopa wrote:I can't quite remember the specifics, do we know if that murder was here or in his story? If the latter, I think him getting mental help, and a chance to live a new life isn't that bad. In a weird way, didn't he not have a choice for his previous murder(s)? He was written to do so by an author. If he uses his new free will, unbound by the scribes quill, to be a new man, I say let him.


The murder was in his story. The man he's referring to is Pirelli, the first man he kills in the play.
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