Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

"If you leave us in peace, we will do you no harm. If you wish to join us, we will set a chair at our table and work to our mutual benefit. If you work against us, we will have no choice but to retaliate."

[RIP Morgan, Erik, and Juan 26 Dec 2012]
[Moriarty refictionalized 16 Dec 2012]

Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby Qara-Xuan Zenith on Thu Dec 06, 2012 8:29 pm

A has confirmed that the echo Batman found was Juan's only echo.

A also suggested using it as 'leverage' before immediately proceeding with refictionalization. So I guess this would be the place to discuss pros and cons of that.

Mr A has confirmed Juan's trope to be Unwanted Harem.

Submissions should be pasted or linked in comments on Holmes' blog (rather than emailed to Mr. A as usual).
Last edited by Qara-Xuan Zenith on Sun Dec 09, 2012 11:10 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby WackyMeetsPractical on Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:36 pm

This may be something worth e-mailing Morgana about. If we were to use it for leverage, maybe we could find out what Morgan and/or Juan are willing to do to keep his refictionalization from happening.
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby Pixelmage on Thu Dec 06, 2012 10:46 pm

According to her email to me, she stated that she would no longer read any emails sent by us should we find her second echo. Knowing that we now are greenlit to refic Juan, I'm reasonably sure she'll behave like that from now on.

So, Morgan, if you are following these developments and will indeed close communications, as I imagine you'd pay close attention to a thread like this one... Could I ask that you contact us somehow to let us know of your decision? Perhaps as an email to Ed or Joe requesting that it be made public? As I believe that as our situation stands, both of them would agree to disclose it, if not for themselves, but for knowing that you could instead email each and all of us in a less official note, to the same end effect.
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby WackyMeetsPractical on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:27 am

Pixelmage wrote:According to her email to me, she stated that she would no longer read any emails sent by us should we find her second echo. Knowing that we now are greenlit to refic Juan, I'm reasonably sure she'll behave like that from now on.


It's not exactly the same. The reason she said that she would stop reading e-mails is that she's afraid one of us would slip her one of her refics and trick her into reading herself back through the wall. We can't exactly do that with Don Juan's story, unless Don Juan makes it a habit to go through Morgan's e-mail.
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby Patchy♪ on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:47 am

believe me, I'm ALL for winning this game and securing the wall ASAP, but we can NOT use Don Juan's echo as a hostage! D:

is it strategic? of course! But what kind of image does that cast us as? If we start playing dirty than the Cabal is equally encouraged to do so and is even MORE encouraged to oppose our lovely Mr. Administrator. If you ask me, we do nothing with it at the time being, knowing we're capable of sending Don Juan back should be enough of a shock to the Cabal to let them realize that we're not playing around. They might be antagonizing us and what we stand for, but the Cabal deserves to be happy just as much as we do. I'm all for fulfilling Mr. A's plans, but we should at least be fair about it.
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby Dryunya on Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:42 am

I wanted to email Morgana asking for the conditions Don Juan wanted (they wouldn't bargain with me anyway, because they know I'd refic him in the end), but then I decided against that, because... (drumroll) I came up with a refic idea! :D

It's a song cover. :shock:

If you followed our offtopic song projects, you probably know that I have a hard time finding a place to sing without interruptions, but in the very least I'll post the lyrics to someone who can.

Saving the universe with The Power Of Rock! ^__^
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby H22 on Fri Dec 07, 2012 6:39 am

Patchy♪ wrote:believe me, I'm ALL for winning this game and securing the wall ASAP, but we can NOT use Don Juan's echo as a hostage! D:

is it strategic? of course! But what kind of image does that cast us as? If we start playing dirty than the Cabal is equally encouraged to do so and is even MORE encouraged to oppose our lovely Mr. Administrator. If you ask me, we do nothing with it at the time being, knowing we're capable of sending Don Juan back should be enough of a shock to the Cabal to let them realize that we're not playing around. They might be antagonizing us and what we stand for, but the Cabal deserves to be happy just as much as we do. I'm all for fulfilling Mr. A's plans, but we should at least be fair about it.


Oh, I'm quite happy playing dirty. If it's the only way we win this game, we might as well use it to win diplomatically. Pitt or Lincoln had no qualms over using patronage and so on for leverage; ths could give us advantages over both the Cabal and Mr. A. Incidentally, interesting there's only 1 echo. Maybe the GMs have noticed we're completely incapable of getting any more :)
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby Dryunya on Fri Dec 07, 2012 6:46 am

H22 wrote:Incidentally, interesting there's only 1 echo. Maybe the GMs have noticed we're completely incapable of getting any more :)

Batman begs to differ. :gurt: I also disagree for meta reasons - all (or most) of the echoes were pre-drawn, so they have to fit them somewhere. If my assumptions are correct, they have to fill a comic book with them.
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby Pixelmage on Fri Dec 07, 2012 1:21 pm

WackyMeetsPractical wrote:It's not exactly the same. The reason she said that she would stop reading e-mails is that she's afraid one of us would slip her one of her refics and trick her into reading herself back through the wall. We can't exactly do that with Don Juan's story, unless Don Juan makes it a habit to go through Morgan's e-mail.


I suppose I should elaborate better, here's the excerpt of the email:
Morgan wrote:If my second echo is located and retrieved, I will no longer be reading any of your emails. I know your group well enough by now to know that someone will try to pull a gambit where I unwittingly read my own refictionalization, or James', or Juan's, or Erik's. Therefore I will be out of touch, unless I decide to send out an email to you. But I will not be answering any more questions or offering any more aid. Call this paranoia, but it does not have to last forever.

I get from that passage, that she'd be unwilling to risk exposing the others to their stories as well. If, thanks to us being able to refic Juan, she already took that decision, I believe our best bet is to ask for her confirmation on it. I certainly hope that this is not the case, but if it is, asking openly seems like a good idea to me. ^^
But of course, let's email her asking about this development anyway, in case she has not closed herself to us. There are plenty of options open at the moment. We don't need to follow only one path. We can try everything concurrently and see which path yields results. ;)
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby eli_gone_crazy on Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:04 pm

I'm against using Juan's echo as leverage.
However, morgan will probably refuse to read/hear anything we have to say because we found the echo... so... dilemma dilemma.
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby H22 on Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:50 pm

Dryunya wrote:
H22 wrote:Incidentally, interesting there's only 1 echo. Maybe the GMs have noticed we're completely incapable of getting any more :)

Batman begs to differ. :gurt: I also disagree for meta reasons - all (or most) of the echoes were pre-drawn, so they have to fit them somewhere. If my assumptions are correct, they have to fill a comic book with them.


Going a bit derailing, but it's possible they've written them but simply not announced them.
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby Qara-Xuan Zenith on Sun Dec 09, 2012 2:43 am

Well, Holmes and Poirot want us to write Juan refics for them to use as leverage to ensure his compliance in the deal.
Why are we even arguing about a dead fictional dude and hypothetical ninjas?

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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby S_o_S on Sun Dec 09, 2012 8:17 am

Is his trope confirmed as Unwanted Harem?
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby Dryunya on Sun Dec 09, 2012 8:54 am

Yes, it is.
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby Qara-Xuan Zenith on Sun Dec 09, 2012 11:09 am

Well, I guess you can all see on the blog that I've put my submission in. I didn't give Juan the Unwanted Harem...

And yes, the implication is that he's been poisoned. Like I said, I wrote him the refic I felt he deserved. :twisted:
Why are we even arguing about a dead fictional dude and hypothetical ninjas?

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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby Qara-Xuan Zenith on Wed Dec 12, 2012 1:08 am

Oh, and folks, while there's no straight deadline for this one, A has said that he wants them in ASAP.

So... if you're feeling frustrated about the ending I wrote, then please, please use that as the impetus to provide a better one yourself, and get it out there!

Not to whine, but I find it frustrating when, despite everyone's complaints, mine is still the only one there.
Why are we even arguing about a dead fictional dude and hypothetical ninjas?

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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby narrativedilettante on Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:56 am

All right Qara, now mine is up there too.

And I'm sorry for how we've frustrated you.
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Re: Refictionalization/Leverage: Don Juan

Postby H22 on Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:37 am

I don't think I can do anything with the tropes. Sorry.
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