Morgan's Emails

[H22]

Were you expecting different questions? Different points? Less contact? More contact? Less... forceful views? Off topic: Why Morgan not Morgana? [size=50]Yet more offtop: Who chose SOPA?[/size]

[Dana]

It's not SOPA, it's in there as OSPA

We expected a little more support for the Cabal, I think. Maybe a little less seething hatred, at least. More respect shown to Morgan? I dunno, something along those lines. We figured we would run the gamut of interactions, though, and we did.

And she goes by Morgan because that's her name. She was originally called Morgen in the Vita Merlini, and Morgan is the closest modern approximation. Her wikipedia page is also Morgan, not Morgana. Morgana always seemed like it was made to sound villainous and witchy, which I'm sure was the point. If we were going to call her anything else that was a variation on her name, it would have been Morgaine.

[H22]

It's not SOPA, it's in there as OSPA

We expected a little more support for the Cabal, I think. Maybe a little less seething hatred, at least. More respect shown to Morgan? I dunno, something along those lines. We figured we would run the gamut of interactions, though, and we did.

And she goes by Morgan because that's her name. She was originally called Morgen in the Vita Merlini, and Morgan is the closest modern approximation. Her wikipedia page is also Morgan, not Morgana. Morgana always seemed like it was made to sound villainous and witchy, which I'm sure was the point. If we were going to call her anything else that was a variation on her name, it would have been Morgaine.

I can't say I was the greatest fan of eg. 'I hope you all did in a fire', so I see what you mean. I just thought, after her email was released, they'd just... not contact her. But it's interesting that you thought that there would be more support as opposed to necessarily almost negotiating.

[RotavatoR]

It's not SOPA, it's in there as OSPA

AHUM

[H22]

It's not SOPA, it's in there as OSPA

AHUM

I was asking more of the actual names, not the acronym.

[RotavatoR]

It's not SOPA, it's in there as OSPA

AHUM

I was asking more of the actual names, not the acronym.

Well then neither me nor Dana got that

[Connor Fallon]

Yeah, I think Dana hit the nail on the head with "We were just expecting less seething hatred." I'm biased, of course, but I feel the cabal made legitimate points, that often didn't make any ripples at all because people had already decided how they felt.

I think, as I've said multiple times, that this was largely our bad -- much of our early improv actually wound up making the Cabal look worse, and Mr. A look better. Early on, pre-AMA, I think the two were actually pretty even handed. I remember Xana almost immediately wanted to take their side. I wish we had that as an option early on.

This is a personal opinion, I think maybe some of the stuff we did, like having them leave the voice mails, was a little out of character in retrospect for most of them given their motivation. Their motive for Joe was to keep fictionals from being discovered and persecuted, and by that point they already were. Though those voice mails were really fun to record.

There was also the issue of the whole group being blamed for the actions of Moriarty, who was canonically acting alone. Goddamn it, Mori. Ruining everything.

[H22]

Yeah, I think Dana hit the nail on the head with "We were just expecting less seething hatred." I'm biased, of course, but I feel the cabal made legitimate points, that often didn't make any ripples at all because people had already decided how they felt.

I think, as I've said multiple times, that this was largely our bad -- much of our early improv actually wound up making the Cabal look worse, and Mr. A look better. Early on, pre-AMA, I think the two were actually pretty even handed. I remember Xana almost immediately wanted to take their side. I wish we had that as an option early on.

There was also the issue of the whole group being blamed for the actions of Moriarty, who was canonically acting alone. Goddamn it, Mori. Ruining everything.

I believe I pointed that out, at some point. What do you mean? Moriarty's awesomeness is the sole reason I supported the Cabal!
I think that some would have opposed anyway. But I thought the initial nastiness actually helped some think 'okay, they were desperate, they've mellowed.'

I thought they had a lot of good points, but (to quote a Soviet spy prostitute) 'I would say that, wouldn't I.'

[Genndy Oda C.O.G.]

As I said in very small print on my post in "Highlights" I apologize for my... awkwardly casual e-mails to Morgan. I thought you guys would expect more than simple status updates that you already knew, so I tried conversation. Again, sorry.

[BlackWolfe]

I think the problem with the Cabal was the members.

Morgan le Fay was, in Le Morte d'Arthur and virtually all later works, a villain through-and-through. In many versions, she takes her sister Morgause's role as the mother of Mordred. In those works (as well as Morte), she is shown as a vindictive, spiteful person at best. In earlier works, she was much more sympathetic (and, indeed, in her earliest incarnations she was clearly a virtuous figure instead of a villainous one), but being unfamiliar with those works left me unwilling to trust her.

Moriarty was not only a criminal mastermind, he was retconned into being the mastermind behind crimes Holmes had already solved, showing that he had no problems not only getting others to do his dirty work but letting them take the fall as well.

Long John Silver was the notoriously bloodthirsty First Mate of an even more notoriously bloodthirsty pirate and his equally bloodthirsty crew. He contrived to get the remnants of that crew hired on for the voyage to the titular Treasure Island, spent the voyage manipulating Jim Hawkins in order to win his affections in order to secure the map to the treasure, and organized a mutiny under the noses of the more reputable members of the crew. He's likeable, but a villain to the bone, and willing to use that likeability to his own benefit.

Don Juan has always been portrayed as a seducer whose only thought was of the conquest. He would use any lie, manipulating women shamelessly in order to bed them. As he was generally (okay, always) successful, calling him an accomplished liar is an understatement.

Erik, another liar and manipulator (his whole "Angel of Music" routine, playing on Christine's belief that she was being visited by the angel her father spoke of) who used any means, including lying, murder, torture, and threats of more of the same, in order to achieve his goals. In the original story, he relented only when Christine agreed to marry him. Despite all of this, he has always been the most sympathetic of the group (with the exception of Morgan) due to his Freudian Excuse. Even so, Joseph Merrick didn't become a homicidal maniac.

Actually, I think the wonder of the Cabal is that they banded together at all.

[Connor Fallon]

Again, Blackwolfe, in what was I think probably one of our better Morgan arguments... a lot of them were in really sucky situations. And historically, struggle can breed animosity and lead to less than moral action. Here, they had much more freedom, and less reason to resort to that.

I certainly agree having an heroic character as a member would have helped a lot.

[BlackWolfe]

Again, Blackwolfe, in what was I think probably one of our better Morgan arguments... a lot of them were in really sucky situations. And historically, struggle can breed animosity and lead to less than moral action. Here, they had much more freedom, and less reason to resort to that.

I certainly agree having an heroic character as a member would have helped a lot.

My problem wasn't so much that they were villains, but that they were villains whose primary M.O. in all cases was manipulation.

[Dana]

So Moriarty is a jerk through and through, but let me explain how I saw the rest of the Cabal.

The reason Don Juan decided to seduce ladies was that he didn't want to adhere to the idea of anyone but him being in control of his own life. Not society, not rules, and especially not God. So he tried to go as far against the grain as he could in order to forge his own path, man and god be damned. So for him, being here without an author? It was SUCH SANCTUARY that he didn't need to try so hard to outwit everyone else's rules that he just kind of settled into living his life.

Morgan and Erik were both victims of their circumstances. Morgan was a powerful Pagan woman at a time when it was basically considered awful to be all of those. Put together? She was designed to be at odds with Medieval England, so she was. She had to adapt to that world and figure out how to survive in it, which is why the manipulations and such. Erik was basically scorned by all of society for his looks. When he escaped what was essentialy his cage, he became obsessed with the only woman who he felt had ever shown him real kindness, who was able to see beyond his appearance and through to his heart - his music. I believe they both were better embraced by this world than by their own and thrived for it.

What need did they have for serious manipulation here, other than to try to stay in the only place that allowed them to live freely?

And yeah...our Long John was a bit more of just a stereotypical pirate than a super faithful adaptation of the source material. Blame Tom

[BlackWolfe]

So Moriarty is a jerk through and through, but let me explain how I saw the rest of the Cabal.

Oh, I have no beef with your interpretations of the characters, really. I'm just explaining why I, personally, didn't trust them. I saw them all as liars who each had (in the material I was familiar with, remember I was unfamiliar with pre-Morte Morgan) used other people to further their own ends. I saw them seeing us as people who could directly interfere with their goals and pulling out all the stops, playing every sympathy card at their disposal, etc. etc.

In the end, it was their nature as fictives that damned them, which is kind of appropriate to their dilemma, really.

[Connor Fallon]

And yeah...our Long John was a bit more of just a stereotypical pirate than a super faithful adaptation of the source material. Blame Tom

Our Long John was AWESOME. But yes, totally unfaithful.

[Qara-Xuan Zenith]

I therefore absolve myself of all guilt for assuming he was cold and manipulative through and through, then. If he'd been more authentic, I'd totally have been right.

[Connor Fallon]

I therefore absolve myself of all guilt for assuming he was cold and manipulative through and through, then. If he'd been more authentic, I'd totally have been right.

DAMN IT GUYS WE GAVE HER AN EASY OUT. Backtrack, backtrack!

He wasn't unfaithful! He... grew from a well characterized archetype into a stereotype! It was character evolution.

...in the opposite direction of everyone else.

[Dana]

We expected you to look at who they were here, not who they were. People do change.

Cats don't, though

[Tom]

And yeah...our Long John was a bit more of just a stereotypical pirate than a super faithful adaptation of the source material. Blame Tom

Yeah, I went with Rule of Funny in the outline, and Mark stuck to it more or less, while elaborating in general and making it funnier. I designed a character I thought would be funny to see opposite Gulliver. A murdering sociopath wasn't funny; a guy who stole constantly without Gulliver noticing, was funny.

Just look at the picture of him eating a popsicle and tell me it wasn't worth it!

Worth noting, however, that the entire pirate archetype (parrots, peg leg, etc) comes from Long John Silver, so all we did was conform him to an archetype he pioneered.

Also, there are many implications in the text that Gulliver is responsible for the change, not just a witness to it. If I were to make a serious interpretation of the storyline, it would be that someone like Gulliver, whose fundamental goodness and open-mindedness, can influence someone who is not used to that, without even trying.

[BlackWolfe]

We expected you to look at who they were here, not who they were. People do change.

Cats don't, though

I understand that. In my experience, a drastic change is more unlikely than lying about having changed. I came in late, developed a severe case of Archive Panic, and everything I did turn up was along the lines of direct communication from people I believed to be liars. If I had been involved sooner, I might have developed a different opinion.

Look at it this way: I damn well earned my Inspector Javert trope.

[Connor Fallon]

Basically, what we are all saying Qara, is you are still a monster. =P (Please don't take this post seriously)

[Tom]

Oh, and way at the beginning of the thread, you asked why we picked the aliases we did. Your speculation about why the Cabal picked these names was pretty much exactly correct, and it was lots of fun to watch the guesses evolve and get closer and closer.

The only one I picked was Steinitz, a name I got after looking up who was the reigning world chess champion at the time of Moriarty's first publication. Happily, his name was uncommon enough that Googling it pulled him up first, and then it was pretty clear you were dealing with Moriarty.

Steinitz led an interesting (sometimes quite unhappy) life, as I recall from my Wiki Walk. And he wasn't evil (unlike Moriarty). If you are bored, go read about him.

[Connor Fallon]

Pyramus is the one I remember our reasons for picking most clearly, and the one I think is the most clever. Don Juan and Melissa are lovers from opposite sides of a wall.

Of course he chose that nickname before he met Melissa, I think, but ignore that.

Oberon and Angelus are both more punny that alusiony. Oberon was lord of the FEY, and Eric was the ANGEL of music.

[Rick Healey]

We expected you to look at who they were here, not who they were. People do change.

Cats don't, though

Except, of course, when they want to.

[Scarab]

We expected you to look at who they were here, not who they were. People do change.

Cats don't, though

Except, of course, when they want to.

Which basically means never (why would a cat need to change? )