Detectives being framed

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Detectives being framed

Postby Dryunya on Sat Dec 29, 2012 2:37 am

I think there are a lot of questions we all have about this particular plotline. I don't remember all of it to ask everything, so I'll ask about that Holmes' client. You know, the one with an orange beard, who met him at the Cheshire Bar. Don't forget that Holmes specifically said it wasn't Moriarty.
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Tom on Sat Dec 29, 2012 2:44 am

I don't remember what the canon for the Cheshire thing was, so you'll have to wait for Raikes. But the worst work--playing the detectives against each other, and getting them framed for murder--was done by Moriarty. Gulliver's discovery helped Holmes finally realize this.
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Connor Fallon on Sat Dec 29, 2012 2:45 am

This is really a question that can only be fully answered by Raikes.

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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Val Reznitskaya on Sat Dec 29, 2012 2:51 am

Incidentally, I happen to know the answer to this. The guy with the orange beard was indeed Moriarty, and the murders in the beginning were both his doing. You'll have to wait for Raikes for the details though.
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Connor Raikes on Sat Dec 29, 2012 5:12 am

Dryunya wrote:I think there are a lot of questions we all have about this particular plotline. I don't remember all of it to ask everything, so I'll ask about that Holmes' client. You know, the one with an orange beard, who met him at the Cheshire Bar. Don't forget that Holmes specifically said it wasn't Moriarty.


Oh, it was Moriarty; every feature about that character indicated that he was keeping his features obscured, from his sunglasses to his beard to his clothing to the poor lighting in the pub. I should have been clearer about that; then again, I should have chosen a pub in the London area that didn't have the name of another character in its title. That was totally unintended, but a really fun reaction to watch from the tropers.
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Connor Fallon on Sat Dec 29, 2012 5:18 am

I personally loved the beat where the players honestly wondered if Cheshire Cat might be behind it all. I remember one person seized upon the orange beard in addition to the name of the pub. I wonder if they just pictured the cat having replaced the head of a manikin for this meeting.

Which I admit is as awesome mental image.
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby WackyMeetsPractical on Sat Dec 29, 2012 5:29 am

Connor Fallon wrote:I personally loved the beat where the players honestly wondered if Cheshire Cat might be behind it all. I remember one person seized upon the orange beard in addition to the name of the pub. I wonder if they just pictured the cat having replaced the head of a manikin for this meeting.

Which I admit is as awesome mental image.


I believe this was back when he had no mental image of the character to go on, and he could very easily be a Funny Animal, or at the very least, a shapeshifter. Of course I think someone did suggest that the cat just attached himself to some man's chin and pretended to be his beard. I don't think anyone really took that one seriously.
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Connor Fallon on Sat Dec 29, 2012 5:30 am

WackyMeetsPractical wrote:
Connor Fallon wrote:I personally loved the beat where the players honestly wondered if Cheshire Cat might be behind it all. I remember one person seized upon the orange beard in addition to the name of the pub. I wonder if they just pictured the cat having replaced the head of a manikin for this meeting.

Which I admit is as awesome mental image.


I believe this was back when he had no mental image of the character to go on, and he could very easily be a Funny Animal, or at the very least, a shapeshifter. Of course I think someone did suggest that the cat just attached himself to some man's chin and pretended to be his beard. I don't think anyone really took that one seriously.


You had the fragment from the comics, in which the cat was orange.
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby WackyMeetsPractical on Sat Dec 29, 2012 5:35 am

That doesn't necessarily leave out the possibility of him having shapeshifting powers. That was also back before it was firmly established that magic doesn't work here, and the cat's tweets seem to portray him as some sort of omnipotent creature who knew everything before anyone else knows it. But this is a derailment. I'm creating a new thread.
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Dryunya on Thu Jan 03, 2013 9:04 am

So, Holmes didn't recognize his archnemesis right before his eyes.
Tsk, tsk. ;)
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Scarab on Thu Jan 03, 2013 10:27 am

Dryunya wrote:So, Holmes didn't recognize his archnemesis right before his eyes.
Tsk, tsk. ;)


Well let's be fair, Moriarty is a master of disguise too, I'm quite sure
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Rick Healey on Thu Jan 03, 2013 11:56 am

Actually, I have to double-check the notes, but I think that Holmes and Moriarty came from different points in the canon - Holmes came from a point where he had heard of Moriarty but hadn't yet met him, while Moriarty came after. This would explain why Holmes didn't recognize Moriarty immediately - the former didn't know what the latter looked like.
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Qara-Xuan Zenith on Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:36 pm

Wait, but-- didn't he confirm Moriarty's voice for us, eventually?
Of course, for all I know, there could be a point in Holmes' canon where he's heard Moriarty but not seen him, which solves that problem... :roll:
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby H22 on Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:46 pm

Rick Healey wrote:Actually, I have to double-check the notes, but I think that Holmes and Moriarty came from different points in the canon - Holmes came from a point where he had heard of Moriarty but hadn't yet met him, while Moriarty came after. This would explain why Holmes didn't recognize Moriarty immediately - the former didn't know what the latter looked like.

........
Which would neutralise that theory about why Moriarty must be lying because Holmes could not remember the Reichenbach Fall! Aha! Sounding a little like Alan Partridge.
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Flitterbie on Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:15 pm

Dryunya wrote:So, Holmes didn't recognize his archnemesis right before his eyes.
Tsk, tsk. ;)


I just figured that, in addition to Moriarty's disguise, Holmes would have no reason to assume that Moriarty had crossed the wall, and likely would NOT want to imagine the possibility that the only person from his world here was his arch-nemesis, and therefore wasn't making any connections that would lead to that conclusion.
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Dryunya on Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:13 am

Not buying it. Holmes experienced something impossible. After that, everything could happen.
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Scarab on Fri Jan 04, 2013 9:11 am

Dryunya wrote:Not buying it. Holmes experienced something impossible. After that, everything could happen.


Well apparrantly the explanation is that HOlmes from his point in continuity had never even MET Moriarty, whereas the Moriarty we met was from the Richenbach Falls. They were from opposite ends of their own continity, which perfectly explains why Moriarty knew Holmes, but not vice versa.
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Re: Detectives being framed

Postby Sicon112 on Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:37 pm

Scarab wrote:
Dryunya wrote:Not buying it. Holmes experienced something impossible. After that, everything could happen.


Well apparrantly the explanation is that HOlmes from his point in continuity had never even MET Moriarty, whereas the Moriarty we met was from the Richenbach Falls. They were from opposite ends of their own continity, which perfectly explains why Moriarty knew Holmes, but not vice versa.


He seemed to imply he had come across him personally, but had not been able to beat him.
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