Guardians?

[Chief Wakamakamu]

Hey guys, I saw something about Guardians earlier, I'm a little confused as to what that is about or for.

[Goldude]

It's to prevent new fictional characters from coming onto our side of the 4th wall.

[Adell]

We wrote a few for Mr.A to position at the cracks to protect them.

https://twitter.com/GurtTheLimeMan this man leads them.

[DrunkGirlfriend]

The various Guardians are here if you want to read up on them.

[Sicon112]

That's assuming you have a Google account. A guy from TVTropes pastebin'd the articles and posted the links in the thread for those who don't. Gimme a sec and I will dig up the links.

EDIT:
http://pastebin.com/MN0nAieS
http://pastebin.com/FnG7LzDC
http://pastebin.com/ZDgEGWEc
http://pastebin.com/NhLxp5Dx

Someone actually qualified to edit TVTropes should put those up on the timeline.

[AceOfSpades]

Question, why is preventing fictional characters to entering this world considered life or death.

[Sophira]

Having used Google Docs before, if the folder is public (and it looks like it is) then you can just mangle the URL a little bit to get a version you don't need to log into Google for:

https://docs.google.com/folder/d/0B_g7n ... pQZzQ/edit

Works for me. Give it a try.

[Sicon112]

Oh nice. Thanks a bunch.

[OhNoABear]

Question, why is preventing fictional characters to entering this world considered life or death.

Our man who never smiles (Read: Mister Administrator) has implied that the continued travel through the wall will damage it further and that the ultimate effects of such damage are unknown, but not likely to be pleasant.

I don't see any real reason to doubt him on this, and it just seems safer over all.

[AceOfSpades]

Question, why is preventing fictional characters to entering this world considered life or death.

Our man who never smiles (Read: Mister Administrator) has implied that the continued travel through the wall will damage it further and that the ultimate effects of such damage are unknown, but not likely to be pleasant.

I don't see any real reason to doubt him on this, and it just seems safer over all.

To be honest I don't really trust Mr. A. He seems the type that if it turns out to not be true, he'll make it true.

[Scarab]

To be honest I don't really trust Mr. A. He seems the type that if it turns out to not be true, he'll make it true.

You and me both. He hasn't behaving like a trustworthy individual.

Neither do the people sending the letters, for that matter. Joe supposed maybe they were characters themselves, in which case this was potentially a really dumb way to go about confronting the only person who, at that point, had really noticed any patterns. All they did, assuming it's them, was draw more attention to themselves, and threatening him did nothing to dissuade us of the importance of working this out.

Still I must also agree with other points made - there seems something fundamentally concerning about the idea of the walls between fiction and reality no longer being sound. Human beings are naturally drawn to fiction and storytelling, but at the end of the day we can close the book and turn off the computer. What happens when we can't do that anymore?

[AceOfSpades]

To be honest I don't really trust Mr. A. He seems the type that if it turns out to not be true, he'll make it true.

You and me both. He hasn't behaving like a trustworthy individual.

Neither do the people sending the letters, for that matter. Joe supposed maybe they were characters themselves, in which case this was potentially a really dumb way to go about confronting the only person who, at that point, had really noticed any patterns. All they did, assuming it's them, was draw more attention to themselves, and threatening him did nothing to dissuade us of the importance of working this out.

Still I must also agree with other points made - there seems something fundamentally concerning about the idea of the walls between fiction and reality no longer being sound. Human beings are naturally drawn to fiction and storytelling, but at the end of the day we can close the book and turn off the computer. What happens when we can't do that anymore?

What happens when a new disease threatens to wipe us out? What happens when natural disasters pretty much kill a tiny fraction of earth's population? What happens when a new war and power hungry dictator tries to exterminate a race he doesn't like. Simple, we cope. We deny it, fight it, do what it takes to not let it get to us in all the ways it can, but in the end we pretty much do what we as a race always do. We cope.

[Dryunya]

Trying to put the whole thing back on track.

There have been some speculations that Mr. A may turn the guardians against us if he gets hostile. I'd like your opinions on the subject. Here are my thoughts on the characters:

Lime man: absolutely no character information besides undeniable badassery. His calling, though, is "round up the criminals, cart them back to jail, and stand watch over the prison so that they would never escape again". I believe that if he sticks to the mission, we'll be fine.
Angel: a robot girl bent on protecting her father. I don't even know how she was made to guard the wall in the first place.
Gnarbrydh: a freakish entity that unconditionally follows its master's orders. We are screwed.
Subject Psi: No idea.
The Regulator: Even as the author, I'm kind of confused. He is an explicit Mr. A's henchman, but he seems to follow him because of his sense of loyalty to the mission, and belief in the "grave consequences" if the wall is breached. Considering that Mr. A dictates the canon within the ARG's bounds, I say he may twist him into fighting us.

In short, don't piss Mr. Administrator off. We have no idea what they're capable of.

[AceOfSpades]

My mind says I agree, my ego says bring it on.

[Aster Azul]

Bah, reality is too tough to break! I'm confident in the universe's ability to stand up to a bit of fictional intrusion.

Now what we should REALLY be doing, is inventing really pleasant fictional characters to intrude into our universe so we can date them.

Oh my God, I have to find out where Mary Poppins has shown up so I can marry her.

[Victin]

I have a question. If someone from our said manage to pass through the wall, what the guardians do?

[AceOfSpades]

Well if they can't send them back to the fourth wall they would do what Mr. A might do.

[Lordxana0]

My guess the cracks in the walls would appear as rifts in reality, as long as they are there to watch them we are fine. If someone got through they can't follow because any entry into our world makes more cracks, plus no way to get back. As for how Mr. A controls them maybe he just created them the same way he created his copies, he spawns them off himself and then gave them powers and abilities that were listed in the story. He has complete control over them the same as any other copy and they have bad ass powers.

[Scarab]

I have a question. If someone from our said manage to pass through the wall, what the guardians do?

An intriguing question... is it even possible?

What about people who may already exist close to that barrier? You get a number of people who take on personas online, and sometimes it gets to point where you're not sure how much is character and how much is just them: I mentioned the yogscast somewhere: real people, but with characters they play. The the Zombie Hunters webcomic: characters originally based on the author and her friends, and they certainy aren't the only examples. We know the people more than the characters. Perhaps the closer you are to that line, the easier it is to slip through... assuming slipping through the other way is even possible.

I dunno, that could be crazy talk on my part...

[Pixelmage]

It must be possible to interact with the other side, otherwise, no fictional character should be able to come to our side.
Problem is: The fictional side is multiversal.

I, myself, as Pixelmage am a fictional character. The Real!Me interfaces with the Pixelmage!Me, however, the Pixelmage's verse is that of the internet, therefore my fictional projection can only interact with other fictional characters that can act upon this medium.

Pixelmage!Me CANNOT act on the physical world, in the same way Real!Me is not the one doing the talking right now. In the same way, Pixelmage!Me is not a part of Alice's Adventures in Wonderland, which means Pixelmage!Me cannot interact with Cheshire outside the Twitter because Cheshire is somehow manifesting his presence there, a hibrid realm that's part of Pixelmage's verse.

Thinking that way, the big problem here is that some manifestations, like the Knight in Joe's video, are acting on our Physical realm. Even Cheshire is, in a way acting in the Physical, being the one who wrote the "Welcome to Hogwarts" letter... WAIT!

That also implies interaction between different verses. Hogwarts does not exist within Wonderland, therefore, if Cheshire knows of Hogwarts, it is because he can interact with another realm or he came into contact with it after reaching our side. That would take considerable time, meaning either he knew about it before coming here, or that he's here for way longer than we realize.

I trail off too much... Sorry.

Back on the subject of going into the fictional world, it should be possible. But I can't think of a method besides Fanfiction writing, and that's meta-travel at best. Not the physical transposition that would be desired.

I don't think the guardians are really a issue here. The way I see the wall, and thinking of power levels, there's no way they could stop a Hulk from smashing through if he wanted, or prevent a Real Realm being from simply waltzing past them. I'll create a world caled "Neo Gaia from Tokyo" where Pixelmage lives, as I am Pixelmage, I'll just upload my mind into my fictional persona and, voila, I'm the other side: I'll just gate into one of Marvel's planes or something. They, maybe, can stop fictional characters, but I don't see how they could stop an "Author" from doing anything.

Could it be a simple question of faith/belief, as in "I belive that the gardians won't let me into the fiction verse, therefore they don't" aganist "I'll just have a tea with Cthulhu, therefore the table and teaset spawn before me"?

[Dryunya]

Could it be a simple question of faith/belief, as in "I belive that the gardians won't let me into the fiction verse, therefore they don't" aganist "I'll just have a tea with Cthulhu, therefore the table and teaset spawn before me"?

I think it's only a question of faith if you are doing it in "your own" fictional world - that is, in your imagination. In this ARG, we are limited by canon, and, as I said, the canon is dictated (after Word Of God, of course) by "empowered" characters, and we assume Mr. A to be one. Even if he lies, some of what he says is true, and that's what makes the ARG's canon. In short, if he says "your guardian has failed to apprehend Cthulhu and he broke through", you can say "that's not true, my guardian in an undefeatable badass", and that becomes your canon. But no one would play along, I guess, if you don't branch that into your own ARG, with blackjack and Mary Sue guardians.

[Pixelmage]

I think it's only a question of faith if you are doing it in "your own" fictional world - that is, in your imagination. In this ARG, we are limited by canon, and, as I said, the canon is dictated (after Word Of God, of course) by "empowered" characters, and we assume Mr. A to be one. Even if he lies, some of what he says is true, and that's what makes the ARG's canon. In short, if he says "your guardian has failed to apprehend Cthulhu and he broke through", you can say "that's not true, my guardian in an undefeatable badass", and that becomes your canon. But no one would play along, I guess, if you don't branch that into your own ARG, with blackjack and Mary Sue guardians.

I understand.
So the question here would be to understand the in-cannon "power level" of the guardians. And, since it's been stated that our help is required to handle the problem, how much of the "Author Power" we do have at our hands.

For starters, WE wrote the Metaguards into existence.
I would belive Mr. A is not allowed actual creation, which is perhaps why we are needed to fix The Wall.
That could imply a counterpart, some other cannon defining being we are not aware of.
I'm also not sure where Joe fits. Is he a player or a god? Mr. A instructed us at the beginning to listen to him, and I don't se him over here, so I'm leaning towards god.

But, if the Metaguards turn out to be a problem, would it be possible to stop them? How do you kill a fictional character when you're not it's Author or it is acting outside it's cannon?

I.e. Cheshire's Twitter. Lewis Carroll (if alive) could kill him in-wonderland easly, but what would that mean for the one on our side teasing us with his #hastags and criptic tweets? Also, since I'm not Carroll, I can't write true-woderland events, so how could I manipulate Cheshire or kill him should it be necessary?

I guess that applies to all the fictional characters acting here... If we're supposed to send them back, what power do we have in order to do so?

Oh well, it's like playing Mao all over again... Not knowing all the rules is HARD!

[Sicon112]

Theory: Mr A is incapable of creating things such as stories and characters for a very specific reason. According to my theory, all beings can be defined in relation to the fourth wall. We, for instance, as in the actual people behind the computers, can be defined as completely in reality. Characters like Amuro Ray or the Cat can be defined as fully fictional, regardless of where they currently are. Mr. A is neither of these things. He exists at a third point: the great white void. He lacks the ability to create fiction that those on this side of the wall, and cannot be effected by fiction created by those on this side, like other fictional characters can. This can even be extended to the recursive view of the fourth wall from Echo Chamber involving shows within shows. Every one of the infinite permutations of reality and fiction seems to have it's own fourth wall. Those to the 'reality' side of that wall, can create fiction that appear on the 'fictional' side of the wall. As long as you are on the reality side, you can effect fictional sides infinite levels below you (Theoretically), just as authors of a show can control the Show Within A Show inside of it.

EDIT: Also I don't think Joe is a god of some kind. Actually, I think it's the opposite. Mr. A chose him because he is average, not despite it. After all, average people are really the easiest to manipulate. Too smart, and they have an annoying tendency of catching wind of your plans, too dumb and, in the words of a certain pirate, "You can never tell when they are about to do something incredibly... stupid."

[Dryunya]

The theories get more and more convoluted. I have a hard time following all of you, even though I still manage.

Every one of the infinite permutations of reality and fiction seems to have it's own fourth wall. Those to the 'reality' side of that wall, can create fiction that appear on the 'fictional' side of the wall. As long as you are on the reality side, you can effect fictional sides infinite levels below you (Theoretically), just as authors of a show can control the Show Within A Show inside of it.

This actually makes sense. Let me try to say it in my own terms.
Let's assume that every world has a fictional world tied to it. "Real" world can manipulate its fictional world, and, if required, its underlying layers. The other way interaction is usually impossible. That would mean that Mr. A, residing in the Void, has his own fictional world that he's in control of, and manipulating the fictional side on the other side of the wall he is on top of requires someone from our world.
I'm not really sure where to fit the Void in that model, and whether all the worlds have a Void between the reality and fiction. In the very least, Mr. A is in control of the Voids in the between IRL and Echo Chamber, and between Echo Chamber and its fictional layers.

Damn, this is getting trippy.

UPD: This is how I think it looks. I think the void's void is out of Mr. A's reach, either.
Speculation: the Void, being atop the wall, is made by TV Tropes, as it's the place where the relation between RL and fictional world is studied. Just an Epileptic Tree.

[Sicon112]

Actually, the point of my theory was that Mr. A is a completely separate type of being precisely because he doesn't seem to have a fictional layer to control. He appears to exist solely in the void, which occurs at every point where there is a wall between reality and fiction, likely all at the same time. The Void is unique in that it appears to be completely free of the ideas of Fiction and Reality. For instance, if someone created a story about the void/set in the void, it would not actually affect he void, but generate an inferior copy of the void on the fictional side of the fourth wall. Get it?